Challenges

[chickenwafer]

I doubt that. This thing was rediculous. Let me explain it like this.

His car currently is to my car; What my car currently is to a Geo.

I know that after the boost issue I'll have no problem walking away from the SS Comaro that my brother stayed dead even with. (with me and his wife in the car. My brother and I add over 440lbs together.) But not that STI/Evo Monster.

Once you get the boost issue sorted you will be able to hang with fully bolted STI's and Evo's. Basically any of those with 400whp or less.

I had a bigger turbo than you, but I could pulled on a 386awhp Evo (fully bolted stock turbo/stock block but clean as hell). I also hung with a C5 ZO6 from a70mph roll (from a dig a Vette will kill us).

The problem with turbo'ing the 8 is it makes 1st gear useless and just spins the tires. The gear ratios suck for turbo. But on the highway they are almost perfect. 3rd or 4th gear from a roll is deadly in a turbo'ed RX-8.

But I still think, now after having an FD, doing either an FD or T2 FC trans swap into a turbo 8 would be one of the best mods for it. The gear ratios are far better for turbo, and with the 4.44 rear end of the 8, it will run like a bat outta hell. Plus, due to the 9k rpm redline, the top speed isn't sacrificed- it's still well over 175mph.

The benefit here, besides the better gearing, is TurboII FC RX-7 transmissions are basically bulletproof, and they're dirt cheap to boot, like $350-$500. Additionally, you have shops rebuild them for >$650, as rebuild kits are easily available. Or, you can even send the trans to G-Force Transmission, and they can retrofit a straight cut gear set in, making it truly bulletproof haha.

The FD trans has slightly better gear ratios, but not by much (1st-3rd are the same IIRC, biggest change is 5th is a huge overdrive. The JDM FD trans has a better 5th gear). But the syncros are weak as ballz on FD gearboxes, and they aren't too strong. But, they are a huge improvement over the stock RX-8 Miata gearbox that can barely handle the power of the Renesis in stock form. The FD transmissions are also very cheap- most people give them away.

[Stealth01]

And no sooner do I say I haven't been challenged in awhile, then a red, 2007-ish Mustang GT (complete with US Marine license plate) messes with me on the way home.

I didn't race him. Not going to create a dangerous situation by trying to pass a guy with more displacement than brains. So I just did what I normally do -- maintained my distance. He was mashing the gas, trying to run away, but I made sure to keep the interval consistent the whole way. For about 3 miles, through numerous WOT runs, where I was able to close the gap at will, just to irritate him. But then I eased up and just smiled at him as he watched in his mirror. By the time we parted ways, he'd given up. But he was at least smiling at me. A little.

[GR-8]

Once you get the boost issue sorted you will be able to hang with fully bolted STI's and Evo's. Basically any of those with 400whp or less.

I had a bigger turbo than you, but I could pulled on a 386awhp Evo (fully bolted stock turbo/stock block but clean as hell). I also hung with a C5 ZO6 from a70mph roll (from a dig a Vette will kill us).

The problem with turbo'ing the 8 is it makes 1st gear useless and just spins the tires. The gear ratios suck for turbo. But on the highway they are almost perfect. 3rd or 4th gear from a roll is deadly in a turbo'ed RX-8.
.........

No kidding, first gear is useless how the car currently is. 3rd gear is the "power" gear. Soon enough I will be able to use all of the rpm range and not have to shift part way through. I floored it in 2nd doing about 30 on the onramp to 6th last night and broke the tires loose.

I doubt I'd be able to beat that STI/Evo or whatever it is. It was like a rocket once he switched gears. Who knows mebe he was running a nice shot of nitrous.

[speedjunkie]

The JDM FD trans has a better 5th gear). But the syncros are weak as ballz on FD gearboxes, and they aren't too strong. But, they are a huge improvement over the stock RX-8 Miata gearbox that can barely handle the power of the Renesis in stock form. The FD transmissions are also very cheap- most people give them away.

I have the JDM FD tranny in mine, and I have a stock FD tranny that has a bad 5th gear synchro. Here pretty soon, I think myself, Mike AND Simon will all have extra tranny's and I think we're gonna try to get them rebuilt when I get back. So there might be one available soon. It won't be free though LOL. I got my JDM tranny for $275 though IIRC.

And no sooner do I say I haven't been challenged in awhile, then a red, 2007-ish Mustang GT (complete with US Marine license plate) messes with me on the way home.

I didn't race him. Not going to create a dangerous situation by trying to pass a guy with more displacement than brains. So I just did what I normally do -- maintained my distance. He was mashing the gas, trying to run away, but I made sure to keep the interval consistent the whole way. For about 3 miles, through numerous WOT runs, where I was able to close the gap at will, just to irritate him. But then I eased up and just smiled at him as he watched in his mirror. By the time we parted ways, he'd given up. But he was at least smiling at me. A little.

Dontcha just love making them know you're faster than they are, and you're not even racing? LOL ESPECIALLY when it's a V8.

[erod550]

And no sooner do I say I haven't been challenged in awhile, then a red, 2007-ish Mustang GT (complete with US Marine license plate) messes with me on the way home.

I didn't race him. Not going to create a dangerous situation by trying to pass a guy with more displacement than brains. So I just did what I normally do -- maintained my distance. He was mashing the gas, trying to run away, but I made sure to keep the interval consistent the whole way. For about 3 miles, through numerous WOT runs, where I was able to close the gap at will, just to irritate him. But then I eased up and just smiled at him as he watched in his mirror. By the time we parted ways, he'd given up. But he was at least smiling at me. A little.

I had almost that exact same situation today with a new 335i sedan. I was behind him getting onto I25 north this morning and when traffic cleared a couple times he would gun it and try to pull on me but I'd stay right with him hehe. There was too much traffic to try to do a side by side pull but I think I might have been able to take him.

All this talk of pulling on 380+awhp Evos from a roll makes me want to get a GT30 lol. If I knew my motor wouldn't blow up I would totally do it. Same situation though, 1st and 2nd gear are already pretty worthless so it would be even worse with a GT30, though the power would come on later than 3k like it does now so maybe it wouldn't be so bad.

[chickenwafer]

Although I have limited experience with the Speed cars/motor, I know turbo sizing, and IMO the GT3071R is the perfect compressor and turbine for that motor if you shooting for north of 350whp. If you're happy/content with less, I'd go GT2871R.

And if you're willing to sacrifice some boost threshold for a much better top end, then the GT3076R would be the ticket. Really though, a GT3071R would get you to at least 430ish whp, a GT3076R would get you to over 460ish. This is with all the supporting mods, of course.

You'd loose a bunch of a low-end response and boost threshold, but the meat of the RPM range would be increased. Really, I'd go GT3071 over the 76 just because the DISI motors run out of breath too quickly for a larger hot side to really be effective.

And I wouldn't say going with a GT30 turbo would be a motor killer, either. It's a well known fact the factory snail is a POS, so stepping up to an aftermarket, oil and water cooled dual ball bearing quality turbo like a Garrett GT30 will give you more reliability in two forms. A) Better quality turbo than OEM, and B ) Since it's much more efficient and larger compressor and turbine, you can run lower boost pressure and make the same power as stock (say 10psi), but still have the option to run more boost and make MUCH more power.

[Stealth01]

Dontcha just love making them know you're faster than they are, and you're not even racing? LOL ESPECIALLY when it's a V8.

Love it. And I'm not even very heavily modded. Of course, when the 2011 5.0s come around, I just cower and hide.

All this talk of pulling on 380+awhp Evos from a roll makes me want to get a GT30 lol. If I knew my motor wouldn't blow up I would totally do it. Same situation though, 1st and 2nd gear are already pretty worthless so it would be even worse with a GT30, though the power would come on later than 3k like it does now so maybe it wouldn't be so bad.

I think you'd be OK. Especially with a pro tune that limited the TQ in gears 1 and 2, similar to the stock tune.

Although I have limited experience with the Speed cars/motor, I know turbo sizing, and IMO the GT3071R is the perfect compressor and turbine for that motor if you shooting for north of 350whp. If you're happy/content with less, I'd go GT2871R.

And if you're willing to sacrifice some boost threshold for a much better top end, then the GT3076R would be the ticket. Really though, a GT3071R would get you to at least 430ish whp, a GT3076R would get you to over 460ish. This is with all the supporting mods, of course.

You'd loose a bunch of a low-end response and boost threshold, but the meat of the RPM range would be increased. Really, I'd go GT3071 over the 76 just because the DISI motors run out of breath too quickly for a larger hot side to really be effective.

And I wouldn't say going with a GT30 turbo would be a motor killer, either. It's a well known fact the factory snail is a POS, so stepping up to an aftermarket, oil and water cooled dual ball bearing quality turbo like a Garrett GT30 will give you more reliability in two forms. A) Better quality turbo than OEM, and B ) Since it's much more efficient and larger compressor and turbine, you can run lower boost pressure and make the same power as stock (say 10psi), but still have the option to run more boost and make MUCH more power.

An addition, many people believe that the way the current K04 and tune give SO much torque so early in the power band is a huge reason we blow so many motors. The 30 series with their later spool may relieve some of that early load and make it less likely to pop the motor. The heaviest loads would be in the later RPMs, not the lower ones.

Eventually, some day, when I've donated enough sperm, sold a kidney, sold my kids into slavery, and taken out a third mortgage, I'd like to go with either a 2871r or a 3071r on the MS6. Dustin down in Albequerque is pushing 449 AWHP with a 3071 setup. 527 tq (although that's on a Dynojet).

[tbot]

Dustin down in Albequerque is pushing 449 AWHP with a 3071 setup. 527 tq (although that's on a Dynojet).

Damn!!! I haven't been on msf in a while...is that what he's pushing?!?! Holy jesus thats insane!


Understand too he also has a FULLY built motor.


So yeah Dave, the only way a GT30 would be beneficial to make more power is with a built bottom end on our cars, without that, increase the boost, and boom.

[Stealth01]

That's off a Dynojet, so probably a bit lower than that. Still damn impressive. And his motor is built with rods and pistons, but he hasn't sleeved it yet...I believe he's working on that too. LOL.

[chickenwafer]

Damn!!! I haven't been on msf in a while...is that what he's pushing?!?! Holy jesus thats insane!


Understand too he also has a FULLY built motor.


So yeah Dave, the only way a GT30 would be beneficial to make more power is with a built bottom end on our cars, without that, increase the boost, and boom.

Yeah I hear you, but I think a GT30 could be a good reliable upgrade as well, just because the factory snail is a smoking POS.

What is factory boost? 15psi or so? With a GT30, you could be running 8-9psi and make the same power with a meatier mid-range. Airflow would be the same as the stock turbo at 15psi, but since the GT30 has a larger and more efficient compressor, it flows the same air at less boost.

Less pressure also means less stress on other parts like couplers, clamps, charge piping, intercooler welds, etc. The other HUGE benefit is the air would obviously be heated less, as the more PSI you push the hotter the air gets as air rapidly heats up with compression. So at 15psi the factory snail is probably heating the charge air to well above 200*F, whereas the GT30 at 9psi (making the SAME power) would only heat the air to 150*F or so.

While you would loose some bottom-end power and torque with increased boost threshold (lag), I believe the benefits would be well worth it. If I ever pick up a Speed car as a daily drive (I plan on it), I would do a GT30 swap just for the reliability and the option for greater power.

[erod550]

Yea I'm not talking about running 20psi on a GT30. Some turbo lag, or at least later spool would actually be nice, as now at 2500rpms in 6th gear I have to be careful going up hills because the thing spools so fast I can be at 18psi in about 2 seconds if I give it too much gas. And launches are very tough because there's a fine line between bogging it and roasting the tires. A later spool would help with that. I dunno if I'll ever do it as I've actually considered going back to stock and trying to get rid of the car but it's a possibility.

[Stealth01]

Yea I'm not talking about running 20psi on a GT30. Some turbo lag, or at least later spool would actually be nice, as now at 2500rpms in 6th gear I have to be careful going up hills because the thing spools so fast I can be at 18psi in about 2 seconds if I give it too much gas. And launches are very tough because there's a fine line between bogging it and roasting the tires. A later spool would help with that. I dunno if I'll ever do it as I've actually considered going back to stock and trying to get rid of the car but it's a possibility.

And as the msf.org guys have pointed out, a later spool could help prevent that zoom-zoom-boom effect people have been having.

I was thinking 2871r when I go BT (in like a decade) but maybe 3071 is better.

[chickenwafer]

And as the msf.org guys have pointed out, a later spool could help prevent that zoom-zoom-boom effect people have been having.

I was thinking 2871r when I go BT (in like a decade) but maybe 3071 is better.

It depends on your goals between the two turbos, really.

If you want more than 350-375whp, a GT3071R is the ticket. Really, lag time should be a HUGE difference, but there will be a difference.

It's always difficult for me to talk about lag times with piston motors- only because rotaries just light turbos like nothing else. A stock port 13B-REW in the FD will spool a ball bearing single scroll GT35R to <20psi by 3200rpm. Same turbo on, for example, a Speed DISI motor, wouldn't get to that boost (assuming it could handle it LOL) by at least 4000-4200rpm.

And then to boot, your redline is only 6k-ish, whereas the rotary will spin until 8k all day long, and even higher if you rebuild it right.

[speedjunkie]

^Haha, and I complain that my turbo spools (or supposedly spools) around 3500-3800 LOL. It's just that it goes so fast from 3k to 8/9k, I'm shifting again before I can blink.

[erod550]

Ran into a C4 Vette tonight with a bunch of stickers and ground effects and a spoiler. Vanity plate: SMUUTH1. Slow roll cause neither of us were sure the other was going to go, or maybe he didn't realize what I was driving until he heard the turbo spool up. Either way, we didn't full on launch but once we did go I put a couple bus lengths on him by mid 4th. I had to slow down for the next light and he did a flyby and I did one right back only faster lol. Then we went our separate ways.