MS6 Drivetrain loss

Originalguy · Postby **Originalguy** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

Does anyone know what the powerloss from the drivetrain is on the ms6? just out of curiosity

LaginWagon · Postby **LaginWagon** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

28% +/- 3%

Originalguy · Postby **Originalguy** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

Wow that's quite a bit

LaginWagon · Postby **LaginWagon** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

Most AWD cars lose between 20%-30% drive train power by the time it's at the wheels. Torsen & Haldex are both around that number also. Torsen being the best IMHO, without question.

Originalguy · Postby **Originalguy** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

yeah so that means the stock speed6 is pushing about 210ish hp at the wheels then at this altitude you lose 10% ish too haha wow

rmeeker13 · Postby **rmeeker13** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

Originalguy wrote:yeah so that means the stock speed6 is pushing about 210ish hp at the wheels then at this altitude you lose 10% ish too haha wow

There was a article in the power pages in Import Tuner a couple of months ago that added some bolt ons to the speed6. Completely stock baseline dyno was 168awhp/194tq AEM Intake gained 27hp/40tq so now were at 195hp/234tq. Next magnaflow cat-back gained 7hp/7tq. They also added a cp-e standback which gained only 12hp/13tq...don't know why so low? So starting hp was 168, ending was 214, starting tq was 194, ending was 254.

Rich · Postby **Rich** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

I'm guessing they didn't up the boost with the Standback, but maybe loaded up a preset map to pull some timing. And +40tq from an intake? That sounds quite fishy to me. I found the best bang/buck bolt-ons to be a downpipe, intercooler upgrade, and the Standback.

rmeeker13 · Postby **rmeeker13** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

Rich wrote:I'm guessing they didn't up the boost with the Standback, but maybe loaded up a preset map to pull some timing. And +40tq from an intake? That sounds quite fishy to me. I found the best bang/buck bolt-ons to be a downpipe, intercooler upgrade, and the Standback.

Im not sure about the article but my best upgrades so far are my DP and a complete intake system.

Originalguy · Postby **Originalguy** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

yeah i have read the article multiple times and i have the cpe cai and then im possibly purchacing eric's standback if he is still selling it but yeah ive heard gains such as 30ish hp from the standback. its still suprisingly quick several friends and i had a cruise the other day and i ended up pulling lengths on a stage two cobalt ss and a pretty quick prelude. also i had a buddy who has a honda with a swapped b16 engine not boosted and through third and fourth i kept with him then he began to pull on me around 5th. The ms6 is suprisingly quick for its stats

chickenwafer · Postby **chickenwafer** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

rmeeker13 wrote:There was a article in the power pages in Import Tuner a couple of months ago that added some bolt ons to the speed6. Completely stock baseline dyno was 168awhp/194tq AEM Intake gained 27hp/40tq so now were at 195hp/234tq. Next magnaflow cat-back gained 7hp/7tq. They also added a cp-e standback which gained only 12hp/13tq...don't know why so low? So starting hp was 168, ending was 214, starting tq was 194, ending was 254.

Rich wrote:I'm guessing they didn't up the boost with the Standback, but maybe loaded up a preset map to pull some timing. And +40tq from an intake? That sounds quite fishy to me. I found the best bang/buck bolt-ons to be a downpipe, intercooler upgrade, and the Standback.

More than likely when they installed the intake they disconnected the battery. This resets your LTFT and STFT fuel trims being reset which can run the motor with a leaner air/fuel ratio, making more power. It can be pretty drastic on turbo cars.

If the standback JUST pulled timing without any extra boost you would loose power. Less timing = less power, to an extent. You can only advance timing so far, obviously. But less timing + more boost = more power due to the increased safety threshold of less timing and the additional boost means more power.

My money would be on the standback drastically dropping the open loop AFRs as we all know most factory turbo vehicles, with the Mazdaspeed cars being no exception, run extremely rich to prevent warranty claims.

In 99.99% cases, going from an 11:1 to 12:1 AFR at torque peak will generate more power than advancing timing one degree at the same spot.

Originalguy · Postby **Originalguy** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

so chickenwafer are you standback tune certified? also did you happen to turn onto buckley this afternoon in your 8?

erod550 · Postby **erod550** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

Another reason why FWD (or RWD) cars with equal crank HP have an advantage in roll races. The AWD is great from a stop but it is a power leech from a roll.

Originalguy · Postby **Originalguy** » Mon Nov 30, 2009 9:14

i agree. but then when it snows awd is worth the power loss. It would be a dream come true for someone to invent an awd system with similar powerloss as the fwd or rwd systems

LaginWagon · Postby **LaginWagon** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:14

Originalguy wrote:i agree. but then when it snows awd is worth the power loss. It would be a dream come true for someone to invent an awd system with similar powerloss as the fwd or rwd systems

There are AWD systems that transfer 100% power to the wheels. The Veryon for one. Two different Lamborghinis, and four different Porsche’s.

I don't know of any that aren’t 6/7 figure super cars though...

bobopud · Postby **bobopud** » Tue Dec 01, 2009 9:14

When I got my stock dyno I put down 230 hp to the wheels. So that would be a drivetrain loss of about 17%. If you take uncorrected numbers then the drivetrain and altitude powerloss is about 30% total. My uncorrected hp for my baseline was 192hp.

MS6 Drivetrain loss

MS6 Drivetrain loss

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